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Author Topic: Fibrosure tests  (Read 14307 times)

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Offline Sam1224

  • Member
  • Posts: 62
Fibrosure tests
« on: April 11, 2015, 04:06:58 pm »
As I understand it, Fibrosure test results are calculated by inputting values from a liver panel test into a algorithm and it is used to determine within a degree of certainty the condition of your liver. My question is, once you've undergone treatment and many of the liver panel results have changed for the better, are the results of a subsequent Fibrosure test just as valid? Presumably the liver may have begun to heal but the actual condition probably has not changed much in just a few months. Anyone with any knowledge or experience in this matter?
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Offline koifish54

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  • Posts: 56
Re: Fibrosure tests
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2015, 07:35:08 pm »
Boy that's a great question  ! my fibrosure was f2-f4  which is not great when I asked my GI dr  His reply was I never use that test ever I don't think Dr's don't trust fibrosure just insurance companies
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Offline dragonslayer

  • Member
  • Posts: 873
Re: Fibrosure tests
« Reply #2 on: April 12, 2015, 12:42:35 am »
>> His reply was I never use that test ever I don't think Dr's don't trust fibrosure just insurance companies<<


The values in the mid fibrosis range are known to not be terribly accurate, although it, along with Fibroscan, does seem to be pretty good at identifying cirrhosis.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2015, 08:59:29 am by dragonslayer »
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Paul

DX 2008
Started Harvoni 11/26/14 for 8 wks
Completed 8 wks Harvoni 01/20/15
EOT RNA Quant result:  Detected 29
7.5 wk post tx: Detected < LLOQ(12)
11 wk post tx: UNDETECTED SVR12
24 wk post tx: UNDETECTED SVR24; AST 26; ALT 22; ALP 73
48 wk post tx: UNDETECTED SVR48; AST 18; ALT 18; ALP 70
GT 1a
vl 2.4mil
2008 bpx: Stage&Grade 0
2013 bpx: Stage&Grade: 0-1
IL28B: TT
likely infected early '70s

Offline koifish54

  • Member
  • Posts: 56
Re: Fibrosure tests
« Reply #3 on: April 12, 2015, 09:37:41 am »
Paul So f2-f4 range is such a big range not so sure other than a bx how can you tell if someone has cirrhosis and even bx depends on where they take the specimens  Fibrosure one of the components is inflammation so if that is gone how can that effect fibrosure test what is your thoughts
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Offline sapphire101

  • Member
  • Posts: 238
  • "Stop worrying and start living"
Re: Fibrosure tests
« Reply #4 on: April 12, 2015, 01:48:14 pm »
This still gets me mixed up.
Are there three types of liver biopsies?
1. the old fashioned core needle to the liver.
2. Fibrosure which seems to be a math formula
3. Then another which is some type of Ultrasound?

Do I have this correct?
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Sapphire101
Genotype 1a Fibrosis level 1
Viekira Pak with ribavirin 12 weeks
Pre treatment  VL  1.7 million, AST 45 ALT 65
EOT VL not detected, AST 21 ALT 21
12 week SVR not detected,24 week SVR not detected.
Cured! Class of 2015

Offline dragonslayer

  • Member
  • Posts: 873
Re: Fibrosure tests
« Reply #5 on: April 12, 2015, 11:40:22 pm »
Quote from: sapphire101 on April 12, 2015, 01:48:14 pm
This still gets me mixed up.
Are there three types of liver biopsies?
1. the old fashioned core needle to the liver.
2. Fibrosure which seems to be a math formula
3. Then another which is some type of Ultrasound?

Do I have this correct?

No.. 2 and 3 are not biopsies... Biopsies are considered 'invasive' tests in that they require an actual liver sample to study... Fibrosure is a blood test, therefore, not a 'biopsy'.. And Fibroscan is the one you relate to Ultrasound, which again, by definition, is not a biopsy.

Biopsy is still the gold standard for establishing degree of fibrosis and inflammation.  The other tests are pretty good at the low and high ends, but inaccurate in the middle. They are often used for diagnosing cirrhosis, therefore, but not great at differentiating between F1 and F2 for example.
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Paul

DX 2008
Started Harvoni 11/26/14 for 8 wks
Completed 8 wks Harvoni 01/20/15
EOT RNA Quant result:  Detected 29
7.5 wk post tx: Detected < LLOQ(12)
11 wk post tx: UNDETECTED SVR12
24 wk post tx: UNDETECTED SVR24; AST 26; ALT 22; ALP 73
48 wk post tx: UNDETECTED SVR48; AST 18; ALT 18; ALP 70
GT 1a
vl 2.4mil
2008 bpx: Stage&Grade 0
2013 bpx: Stage&Grade: 0-1
IL28B: TT
likely infected early '70s

Offline koifish54

  • Member
  • Posts: 56
Re: Fibrosure tests
« Reply #6 on: April 13, 2015, 08:15:38 am »
Curious what does a fibrosure result of f2-f4  before treatment with high alt , ast and ggt and after treatment all normal so how would you think that would effect fibrosure test now??
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Offline dragonslayer

  • Member
  • Posts: 873
Re: Fibrosure tests
« Reply #7 on: April 13, 2015, 10:13:03 am »
Quote from: Sam1224 on April 11, 2015, 04:06:58 pm
As I understand it, Fibrosure test results are calculated by inputting values from a liver panel test into a algorithm and it is used to determine within a degree of certainty the condition of your liver. My question is, once you've undergone treatment and many of the liver panel results have changed for the better, are the results of a subsequent Fibrosure test just as valid? Presumably the liver may have begun to heal but the actual condition probably has not changed much in just a few months. Anyone with any knowledge or experience in this matter?

I might be off base here, but if the algorithm uses results from the liver panel, and if the panel improves after treatment, why would that not be reflected in the Fibrosure which is based on them, and why would the result be any less valid when the liver health improves so long as the panel is up to date?
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Paul

DX 2008
Started Harvoni 11/26/14 for 8 wks
Completed 8 wks Harvoni 01/20/15
EOT RNA Quant result:  Detected 29
7.5 wk post tx: Detected < LLOQ(12)
11 wk post tx: UNDETECTED SVR12
24 wk post tx: UNDETECTED SVR24; AST 26; ALT 22; ALP 73
48 wk post tx: UNDETECTED SVR48; AST 18; ALT 18; ALP 70
GT 1a
vl 2.4mil
2008 bpx: Stage&Grade 0
2013 bpx: Stage&Grade: 0-1
IL28B: TT
likely infected early '70s

Offline koifish54

  • Member
  • Posts: 56
Re: Fibrosure tests
« Reply #8 on: April 13, 2015, 10:26:53 am »
Yes Paul I guess why I ask the question is because in two weeks after treatment my all liver numbers were normal I would think 2 week s is a short time for some one to go from f2-f4 to f0, f1  just don't think just my opinion, of course that im not so of fibrosure' accuracy 
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Offline dragonslayer

  • Member
  • Posts: 873
Re: Fibrosure tests
« Reply #9 on: April 13, 2015, 10:43:17 am »
Quote from: koifish54 on April 13, 2015, 10:26:53 am
Yes Paul I guess why I ask the question is because in two weeks after treatment my all liver numbers were normal I would think 2 week s is a short time for some one to go from f2-f4 to f0, f1  just don't think just my opinion, of course that im not so of fibrosure' accuracy

Yea.. I really have no answer to that... Id ask your doctor if I were you... When I talk about relative lack of accuracy on these non invasive tests, its only in a general, comparative sense as compared to liver biopsy.  For specific cases such as your question, I really having nothing more...
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Paul

DX 2008
Started Harvoni 11/26/14 for 8 wks
Completed 8 wks Harvoni 01/20/15
EOT RNA Quant result:  Detected 29
7.5 wk post tx: Detected < LLOQ(12)
11 wk post tx: UNDETECTED SVR12
24 wk post tx: UNDETECTED SVR24; AST 26; ALT 22; ALP 73
48 wk post tx: UNDETECTED SVR48; AST 18; ALT 18; ALP 70
GT 1a
vl 2.4mil
2008 bpx: Stage&Grade 0
2013 bpx: Stage&Grade: 0-1
IL28B: TT
likely infected early '70s
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